Video Review: Archos 43 Internet Tablet compared to A5IT

[Charbax]

An overview of the difference in screen size, touch screen quality, web browsing speed. More on video playback support including a test on streaming video over Samba file sharing.



http://archosfans.com/2010/10/01/archos ... et-tablet/

Let me know what next you would like to see filmed.

My initial Gen8 videos are posted here: http://forum.archosfans.com/viewtopic.php?f=63&t=37752

[d00b]

Good video. The NYTimes page is a text-heavy site, which is a good test for legibility. Also good idea to use a tripod. Things are clearer with this video.

Charbax, can you provide a 10-sec downloadable snip showing the NYT page at full zoom-out, in both landscape and portrait? The Youtube vid even at 720p is blurry.

It looks like the landscape mode is legible at default font size (and the portrait mode of course isn't), but it's hard to tell from the Youtube clip.

[alpha4005]

Archos usually provides good sound quality. Perhaps you could offer your opinion on that.
Also could you show the effects/altercations one could make to the sound?
Is there a user settable equalizer? If not could an app be downloaded to Provide a user controlled equalizer?
Or will we be stuck with the very ipodesque general presets that all sound like crap...

Please and thank you!

also perhaps you could show how it handles internet video, like youtube

[kramer28]

Exactly what I have been waiting for! Not the comparison between both the 43 and the 5IT BUT how good exactly HD video playback was with HD files already on board (not streamed through wifi).

I saw how choppy HD video was through streaming (which i have no care or use of) but saw that you stated that HD video on the player's drive had no issues. I liked the fact that the 1st video included the specs (which are the kind of files I'd play) but I was curious to see the specs of the "Band of Bros" clip he showed that played smoothly. Was that last clip also HD? If so - what were the specs?

Thanks in advance.

[The_Blood_Raven]

Charbax, I really disagree that the speed difference is the due to the processor, at least for browsing. The difference is likely the OS only. I saw a similar comparison between the A5IT and Dell Streak, and they were basically the same even though the Streak's processor is faster, they also ran 1.6. That's not to say there won't be a difference in other areas, I guarantee that there will be. If anything it shows how solid the A5IT remains.

Besides that, I think the 43's screen is JUST big enough for web browsing, and should be fine for one person movies. However, the screen difference from my A5IMT really hurts. I might end up with the Archos 70 after all. Hopefully Charbax will get one in and do a similar comparison with all three devices.

Oh and Charbax, this is some of the best coverage I've seen from you. As always, I really need to thank you. I'm sure many agree with me in saying that your dedication and enthusiasm are very much appreciated.

[bbz_Ghost]

With the higher resolution, I'll take the 43 any day over the 5. Slightly smaller physical dimensions don't mean that much. A lot of people will stick with the "oh you can see more on a larger display" which is utter rubbish considering the 43 has a higher resolution. The actual difference doesn't amount to enough for me to choose the 5 anymore.

Can't wait till the 43 is actually available, already have a 32GB microSD card on order for it so, we'll see what happens.

[sweetypie]

@bbz_Ghost
So, are you going to keep your A5IT or sell it on, when you buy your Gen 8?

[cghori]

Charbax,

Can you do a comparison with Archos 32 vs. Ipod Touch 4?

The screens are similiar in size so it would be interesting to see the differences.

[bbz_Ghost]

@bbz_Ghost
So, are you going to keep your A5IT or sell it on, when you buy your Gen 8?

I've never owned an A5IT or an A5AT, last Archos device I actually owned was many years ago, probably something in the 2nd generation.

[sweetypie]

@bbz_Ghost
So, are you going to keep your A5IT or sell it on, when you buy your Gen 8?

I've never owned an A5IT or an A5AT, last Archos device I actually owned was many years ago, probably something in the 2nd generation.

Ah, my mistake. You seem to be rubbishing so many opinions of people who actually DO own A5IT's, that I was sure you must own one.

I thought you actually knew what you were talking about.

That'll teach me to make assumptions! What an idiot I am.

Sorry ...

[bbz_Ghost]

No problem at all. At least you're not so ignorant that you don't know you're an idiot.

Just because I've never owned one personally (meaning I never chose to buy one with my own money) doesn't mean I don't have a ton of experience using one that belonged to a friend of mine.

Assumptions... they'll make you stupid more than you might believe.

The Archos 43 and the A5IT/A5AT are effectively the same devices in most respects aside from the potential for a physical hard drive in some models of the A5 series. Since the Archos 43 offers the same capabilities and more (HDMI without a dock, anyone?) in a smaller more streamlined and pocketable format with an even higher resolution screen so you can get more info on it as available and at a lower cost/price point sure does make it appear that the 43 is superior in many respects.

That's the point of my posts, I don't see how anyone can really argue that the A5 series of devices is superior just because they're physically larger but with an inferior screen resolution - and apparently because of improvement in the resistive screen quality with respect to the sensitivity of finger control, inferior in that respect as well.

Pretty simple to me.

[sweetypie]

Complete bollocks.

By that measure my Nokia N97 phone is superior to either of my two 32GB or my one 160GB Archos A5IT's. Why? Because it has the "advantage" of only having a 3.5 inch screen, which makes it "more" pocketable.

The degree of pocketability is irrelevant. Pocketability is a pass / fail thing. It's either pocketable or it's not. By your logic, a 1 inch screen would even better again. The prevailing opinion is that the biggest "pocketable" screen is best. And that's seen to be 5 inches.

As to resolution. There's such a thing as wasted quality. It's like posting hi-res photos on a web page - you can't tell the difference, and the page takes ages to load. When I show recorded TV movies on my Archos, to my friends, they think it looks like 3d.

Then again there are the missing features, like GPS.

And a 5 inch screen is the first acceptable size I'd use as my eReader. My A605 has a 4.3 inch screen, and I wouldn't read anything on that.

I'm sorry but, for all your claimed "borrowed" experience, your comments are consistent with people on forums who argue black is white, based on reading specifications, and theoretical differences, rather than day in day out "living with it" true experience.

It appears, from my experience over the past 12 months, that the A5IT is going to be the pinnacle of Archos' technical multifunctionality. That's why people who own them, having paid out their own hard earned cash for them, are buying a spare as a hedge against the future.

[The_Blood_Raven]

Complete bollocks.

By that measure my Nokia N97 phone is superior to either of my two 32GB or my one 160GB Archos A5IT's. Why? Because it has the "advantage" of only having a 3.5 inch screen, which makes it "more" pocketable.

The degree of pocketability is irrelevant. Pocketability is a pass / fail thing. It's either pocketable or it's not. By your logic, a 1 inch screen would even better again. The prevailing opinion is that the biggest "pocketable" screen is best. And that's seen to be 5 inches.

As to resolution. There's such a thing as wasted quality. It's like posting hi-res photos on a web page - you can't tell the difference, and the page takes ages to load. When I show recorded TV movies on my Archos, to my friends, they think it looks like 3d.

Then again there are the missing features, like GPS.

And a 5 inch screen is the first acceptable size I'd use as my eReader. My A605 has a 4.3 inch screen, and I wouldn't read anything on that.

I'm sorry but, for all your claimed "borrowed" experience, your comments are consistent with people on forums who argue black is white, based on reading specifications, and theoretical differences, rather than day in day out "living with it" true experience.

It appears, from my experience over the past 12 months, that the A5IT is going to be the pinnacle of Archos' technical multifunctionality. That's why people who own them, having paid out their own hard earned cash for them, are buying a spare as a hedge against the future.

^ This. While I can't comment on the usability of the two sizes, I completely agree with the pocketability arguement. I guess I should stick with my A5IMT, since the 43 is .3" longer, which is the most difficult dimension to pocket.

[bbz_Ghost]

It appears, from my experience over the past 12 months, that the A5IT is going to be the pinnacle of Archos' technical multifunctionality. That's why people who own them, having paid out their own hard earned cash for them, are buying a spare as a hedge against the future.

Say hello to "forced obsolescence." I had a tough time deciding on whether to get the A5AT in the recent past, made posts here asking for opinions, suggestions, and no one ever gave me a solid concrete enough reason to actually buy one. My biggest gripe is that Archos is so far behind the curve with Android in terms of keeping it updated - oh, but wait, now they're up to speed with this new generation of hardware, at least from the Android perspective.

So they've created some slightly smaller devices, using effectively the same hardware that the A5AT is based upon, more or less, in slightly smaller packages, with better screens, somewhat higher resolution, and all the sudden you're claiming that the newest stuff that's actually running the newer more refined and better performing version(s) of the Android OS are inferior to the models from the last generation?

Wow, I wonder how Archos feels about that. They go through all the trouble of creating these new devices and working on getting them running the newest latest best performing version(s) of Android and... well, it seems a ton of loyal Archos people aren't willing to get the "new stuff" because the old stuff works just fine.

I didn't buy an A5AT because Archos will never get it updated to the latest version of Android, it's really that simple. We'll never see Froyo on the A5AT - Archos isn't going to continue investing time and effort into creating a workable Android 2.1 or 2.2 or heaven forbid a 3.0 firmware for the A5AT or any of the older devices when they've made it quite clear that their focus now is on the newest generation of products.

They might not be as large as Apple, but they're not stupid either: they know they can't keep making the old stuff work nearly as well as the new stuff, even if the hardware shares a lot of traits between generations. There's no money in continuing support for newer versions of the OS on a product that's already been paid for, even Apple knows this, but with Apple's devices the hardware barely changes and yet they actually "get 'er done" for the most part. Example:

I own an iPhone 2G, the original model, and it was made in the summer of 2007 but even in spite of that with each new firmware update that Apple created, the iPhone 2G still remained functional and gained better performance with each new release finally culiminating in the 3.1.3 update - the 4.0 update requires actual new hardware in the device, something the original iPhone 2G simply doesn't have.

That's not the case with the A5AT and the new generation of products - they are in many ways identical hardware as many many people have pointed out, so why do we see the A5AT made just over a year ago still floundering around with what, Android 1.7 on it and the newest generation devices coming with 2.1 on them and a promised 2.2 update very soon? Why hasn't Archos put 2.1 or 2.2 on the A5AT? Anyone able to offer a legitimate reason for it?

Because the company is too fractured as I've been saying for a very long time now - they have too many products and they can't develop for each of them nearly as well as they could if they would just pick one and focus on making it absolutely awesome.

I skipped the A5AT for that reason, and I'm getting an Archos 43 because it's running 2.1/2.2, and that's about it. To be honest, I don't even carry devices in my pocket, I just make that point because some folks do. I rarely ever use a case on my devices, certainly not my Axim X51v I've had for 6+ years that looks practically brand new because I take care of the stuff I spend my hard earned cash on. I consider such purchases investments that deserve being looked after.

The 43 is a smaller A5AT, with an HDMI port (which I have no use for) and some other goodies too. Things get better over time, at least that's the hope. I can't imagine buying an A5AT at this point unless I got one ridiculously cheap and even if I did the first thing I'd probably do is sell it for a profit and apply the funds to the 43 for all the reasons I've covered.

If you're happy with your A5AT, so be it - I never said it wasn't a good device, all I have consistently said is I'm getting an Archos 43. You're reading an awful lot into all this, seriously.

But, those assumptions... idiots... you said it yourself.

[jkajolin]

It appears, from my experience over the past 12 months, that the A5IT is going to be the pinnacle of Archos' technical multifunctionality. That's why people who own them, having paid out their own hard earned cash for them, are buying a spare as a hedge against the future.

Say hello to "forced obsolescence." I had a tough time deciding on whether to get the A5AT in the recent past, made posts here asking for opinions, suggestions, and no one ever gave me a solid concrete enough reason to actually buy one. My biggest gripe is that Archos is so far behind the curve with Android in terms of keeping it updated - oh, but wait, now they're up to speed with this new generation of hardware, at least from the Android perspective.

So they've created some slightly smaller devices, using effectively the same hardware that the A5AT is based upon, more or less, in slightly smaller packages, with better screens, somewhat higher resolution, and all the sudden you're claiming that the newest stuff that's actually running the newer more refined and better performing version(s) of the Android OS are inferior to the models from the last generation?

Wow, I wonder how Archos feels about that. They go through all the trouble of creating these new devices and working on getting them running the newest latest best performing version(s) of Android and... well, it seems a ton of loyal Archos people aren't willing to get the "new stuff" because the old stuff works just fine.

I didn't buy an A5AT because Archos will never get it updated to the latest version of Android, it's really that simple. We'll never see Froyo on the A5AT - Archos isn't going to continue investing time and effort into creating a workable Android 2.1 or 2.2 or heaven forbid a 3.0 firmware for the A5AT or any of the older devices when they've made it quite clear that their focus now is on the newest generation of products.

They might not be as large as Apple, but they're not stupid either: they know they can't keep making the old stuff work nearly as well as the new stuff, even if the hardware shares a lot of traits between generations. There's no money in continuing support for newer versions of the OS on a product that's already been paid for, even Apple knows this, but with Apple's devices the hardware barely changes and yet they actually "get 'er done" for the most part. Example:

I own an iPhone 2G, the original model, and it was made in the summer of 2007 but even in spite of that with each new firmware update that Apple created, the iPhone 2G still remained functional and gained better performance with each new release finally culiminating in the 3.1.3 update - the 4.0 update requires actual new hardware in the device, something the original iPhone 2G simply doesn't have.

That's not the case with the A5AT and the new generation of products - they are in many ways identical hardware as many many people have pointed out, so why do we see the A5AT made just over a year ago still floundering around with what, Android 1.7 on it and the newest generation devices coming with 2.1 on them and a promised 2.2 update very soon? Why hasn't Archos put 2.1 or 2.2 on the A5AT? Anyone able to offer a legitimate reason for it?

Because the company is too fractured as I've been saying for a very long time now - they have too many products and they can't develop for each of them nearly as well as they could if they would just pick one and focus on making it absolutely awesome.

I skipped the A5AT for that reason, and I'm getting an Archos 43 because it's running 2.1/2.2, and that's about it. To be honest, I don't even carry devices in my pocket, I just make that point because some folks do. I rarely ever use a case on my devices, certainly not my Axim X51v I've had for 6+ years that looks practically brand new because I take care of the stuff I spend my hard earned cash on. I consider such purchases investments that deserve being looked after.

The 43 is a smaller A5AT, with an HDMI port (which I have no use for) and some other goodies too. Things get better over time, at least that's the hope. I can't imagine buying an A5AT at this point unless I got one ridiculously cheap and even if I did the first thing I'd probably do is sell it for a profit and apply the funds to the 43 for all the reasons I've covered.

If you're happy with your A5AT, so be it - I never said it wasn't a good device, all I have consistently said is I'm getting an Archos 43. You're reading an awful lot into all this, seriously.

But, those assumptions... idiots... you said it yourself.

I don't really like to go into these debates but few things that I can add.

Apple as a company is one of the biggest out there. Their stock value is bigger than any other that I know. But their stock value has very little to do with Iphone or Ipad etch. Apples main income comes from the laptops and other hardware including license contracts. Sure it helps to have high visibility products like iPhone and iPad.

Archos has nothing to do with the big players out there so one cannot just say that why don't Archos do this when Apple does that.
Leave Apple fanatics to their peace and leave Archos users to their own.

Just be happy that you actually can get new generation devices in some point.

[Charbax]

My biggest gripe is that Archos is so far behind the curve with Android in terms of keeping it updated

Not even Motorola, Samsung, Sony-Ericsson, Dell have been able to update their devices (released later than A5IT) to Android 2.2.

So they've created some slightly smaller devices, using effectively the same hardware that the A5AT is based upon

Gen8 is based on OMAP3630 up to 1ghz, that processor is based on 45nm ARM Cortex A8 process.

Gen7 is based on OMAP3440 up to 800mhz, that processor is based on 65nm ARM Cortex A8 process.

Texas Instruments tried to make those processors software and hardware compatible. It's not that easy. See their comments in my video: http://armdevices.net/2010/02/23/texas- ... -omap3630/

[Charbax]

Apple as a company is one of the biggest out there. Their stock value is bigger than any other that I know. But their stock value has very little to do with Iphone or Ipad etch. Apples main income comes from the laptops and other hardware including license contracts. Sure it helps to have high visibility products like iPhone and iPad.

Actually, the amazing thing is, what brought Apple to be worlds number 2 highest valued company after Exxon Mobile today, is exactly iPod and recent iOS devices.

iOS devices amount to more than 60% of Apple's overall yearly revenues and profits.

The largest portion of Apple's profits comes from the iPhone. A device which they mostly sell to their existing customers not to new customers.

Basically, Apple is a $238 Billion company based on revenue and profits made on repeat customers.

If the iOS devices get out-competed by cheaper and better Android devices, and if Apple can't think of a new cash cow, they will be in big trouble to keep such huge revenues and profits and such high valuation.

[marcel]

All electroincs you buy are obsolete immediatley, UNLESS you buy it for a certain purpose, and it does that job. Why do some poeple use pc's with windows 95? because it does what they want, and they don't need a new one!

I made the mistake of getting an archos 43vision, it hardly played any files without converting (the reason I will not buy apple products), and it died after 3 weeks. but I liked the idea of the product.

I then got the archos 5IT, but I was not aware of the flash video problem, but as a pure video player it was great, but being an archos product, it went wrong in a couple of weeks! but now I miss it, as my portable DVD player has died!

Now I've been reading the forums and learn't loads from them.

If I diddn't want to watch web video, the A5IT would be fine, especially as the price is falling 32GB £230, and it has expandable memory.

I'm undecided about the archos 43IT.
I'd like a bigger screen, the A5It fits my pockets just fine, if size was soo important why do people lug around i pads?

But, I'm waiting to see about the 2.2 update, actions speak louder than words!

I don't care about the screen type, I don't play games

I don't use apps

When I finally see a product that does what (I) want, I will get it, but only with an extended warranty. This is the main reason I haven't bought an archos product, and 2 units going wrong does nothing to ease my mind!


marcel

[sweetypie]

I didn't buy an A5AT because Archos will never get it updated to the latest version of Android, it's really that simple. We'll never see Froyo on the A5AT - Archos isn't going to continue investing time and effort into creating a workable Android 2.1 or 2.2 or heaven forbid a 3.0 firmware for the A5AT or any of the older devices when they've made it quite clear that their focus now is on the newest generation of products.

What load of waffle. Archos have real customers, who buy real products, based on real functionality.

I'm just trying to picture a hypothetical advert, placed by Archos, which would offer what you say you want, but which Archos isn't offering (remembering they never offered it in the first place anyway, but which you blame them for not providing) - Froyo.

"Roll up, roll up, come to Archos, buy one of our devices and get - wait for it............ FROYO!!!....... Tada!!!"

"FROYO"??? what the f*** is Froyo???? (I hear the viewers of QVC say). QVC? Why QVC? Because, in the UK, QVC is THE main outlet for Archos products, en masse. That's where they target their main promotions. So who are these potential Archos customers who watch and buy their technology from QVC? Families, that's who. 98.725% of them have never heard of Froyo, and couldn't give a stuff about specifications and operating systems. They buy their devices based on demonstrations of features, function, and performance. Then they try those functions for 30 days, and, if they work, they keep them.

Unfortunately for Archos, when they released the A5IT, it didn't do what they said it would do. They released it far to early for the "must work straight out of the box" brigade. So the QVC crowd sent them back en masse. I was techy enough to be able to get things to work, and patient enough to wait for firmware updates.

Now finally, after 12 months, my 2 A5IT 32GB models do exactly what they were / are supposed to do, including GPS which is excellent on the SSD models. I also have a 160GB model which works perfectly except for one thing - the GPS takes longer to get an initial lock.

They never promised Froyo, and if they had, they would have had to explain to a load of mums and dads, exactly what Froyo is, and why it matters a damn to what they use the things for. To the best of my knowledge, I've never heard an Archos employee / demonstrator use any of the terms Cupcake, Donut, Eclair, Froyo, or Gingerbread. It's only a few techy types, some of us who have bought the A5 IT's, rooted them, put on the Market, yada yada, who are even aware of these terms.

Ok, I promise, this is my last post. The fact that there are 4000 posts on a bunch of devices which aren't yet available just proves my point about people with no experience of stuff, but want to drone on endlessly about specifications, and theoretical possibilities and which is "theoretically" better or worse than anything else.

I've been around for a while, and have participated in many forums over the years. There's nothing new about this behaviour. I used to be interested in Photography. By "Photography" I mean taking pictures, and using cameras. Both of these pursuits involved investing time and money. So most people on forums had made such an investment, and therefore had an informed opinion.

When you asked for examples of photos, demonstrating what people were talking about, that was when you discovered the ones who argued about cameras based on specifications. Forums now are full of spec readers / quoters. It is only once you actually commit you own cash to buying something that you properly appreciate the real pros and cons of things.

It's dead easy to reject something in your mind, when you have invested nothing in it.

Anyhoo, I'm done with my brief foray into fantasy land. I'm going back to reality, where I belong.

I know my place ...



p.s. It's taken me so long to write this, that another post has appeared in the interim, mentioning flash.

Just how much of a problem is the lack of flash, in real world browsing? For me it doesn't matter at all. I can see that it might hamper your porn viewing, if you're so inclined. If that's so, then you have my sympathy.

Oh, by the way, QVC is on right now, and an "expert" demonstrator of a laptop is explaining what "VGA" means, to the customer base.

Froyo? Ha ...

[bbz_Ghost]

Well duh, they couldn't promise Froyo since it didn't exist yet. But if Apple can still offer updates for their products that increase functionality and extend that usable lifetime, why can't Archos? Is it because they build things with that functional obsolescence I mentioned on purpose? No, I don't think they'd go that far or stoop that low.

So what is it, exactly, that prevents them from keeping the device (speaking of the A5AT here) updated with Android 2.1 or 2.2 which is readily available, and the A5AT is obviously compatible with the OS itself... what's the problem?

If I followed the example that a lot of folks are following, I would simply stick with the Dell Axim X51v that I own, and have owned for 6+ years now, that I paid $550+tax for + shipping + extra batteries + a nice leather case from Sena that I barely use + an extra AC adapter + an extra dock + a ton of Windows Mobile apps over the years and just call it a day.

Dell gave up on the Axims right about the time they were the most worthy kind of PocketPC out there because the focus was starting to shift towards adding PocketPC functionality into a phone, or at least that was the concept with the "smart phone" that is now so prevalent.

Considering this Axim came with an OS that's quite old (Windows Mobile 5) and Dell and many others said "Ok, that's it, it'll never be anything more, no upgrades, no updates, that's it" I was quite pissed at that time, I assure you. I sank a ton of hard earned cash into this device, and luckily because of a lot of very talented folk out there, especially the XDA-Developers community and many others, this Axim continues to live and breathe and be 100% functional to this day, running Windows Mobile 6.5, and OS it was never supposed to be running.

Now, if a 6+ year old piece of technology like my Axim can run an OS that it was never obviously designed for (since the OS didn't exist for years to come), and because the OS was never intended to be put on such a device (WM6.5 is primarily most useful for smartphone PocketPCs), someone tell me how this is so easy to accomplish...

And yet the A5AT is barely a year old and Archos can't get newer versions of Android to run on it?

Something is just plain wrong with that, I don't know what it is but it's just wrong. Maybe Archos needs to stop doing the lockdowns on their devices in terms of the firmware and encryption and the ability to "hack" the devices and just open it up once and for all.

Imagine what people with the talent and creativity like those at XDA-Developers could actually do with a device like the A5AT if it was a totally open or at least vastly more open and "hackable" platform than it is at this precise moment. Hell, we'd probably see people putting OSX or even iOS on it, most certainly some other Linux distros of all kinds.

Artificial constraints on the OS and the hardware are why I don't buy Apple products like the iPod touch. I was sincerely hoping Archos would learn once and for all if they want more business, if they want more customers, if they really want to make some money and stop being a niche product that can't even compete with stuff like the Zune HD in terms of market share. The Zune HD and the A5AT came out about the same time, roughly, and yet the Zune HD has significantly more owners than Archos - and the Zune HD is only available in North America and yet the A5AT is available in far more places. Is it because of Microsoft being the producer of the Zune HD? Somewhat, but not as much as you might think.

I want Archos to succeed, really I do. I wouldn't be here discussing their products if I didn't, and I've got the cash on hand right now to get an Archos 43 as soon as I can order one from a US retailer, but until that happens there's not much I can do about it. When they are available I'll grab one, and if I don't like it, it'll get returned and I'll go back to my Axim and wait for the next potential replacement device to come along.

I could toss out some cash and get a Cowon S9 or J3 but they're not enough - if I want just a music/video device I'd get a Zune HD or something similar. I want something that can replace this Axim meaning it must be a "Pocket PC" aka PDA + PMP = PDAMP as I started calling it in another post yesterday. I could just run to Walmart right now at 6AM and get an iPod touch 4G and deal with it, but I'm not interested in the device.

My plan is to give Archos a chance. If they blow it and the product sucks (in my opinion as an owner when the time comes, of course), it goes back and I move on...