Archos RAM

General topics about the Archos G9 series if those topics don't fit in a specific model category below. Also discuss your ideas, suggestions, hopes, wishes, rumors, informations in here.
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matt198992
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Archos RAM

Post by matt198992 »

Ok, I know specs have been posted, but NOWEHERE can you find the amount of RAM each gen9 tablet will be releasing with.

Thanks to a rep from Facebook though, he has stated ("VERY UNOFFICIALLY") that there might be a 512mb option and a 1gb RAM option.


What do you guys think? Do you think Archos will roll out with a 1gig option as said, and how cheap will it be? I know this has been mentioned in a few articles, but it all seems so unconfirmed by anyone and how much exactly it will cost. Has anyone been able to dig this info up?
Last edited by matt198992 on Tue Jul 12, 2011 6:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Archos RAM sneak peak

Post by Harfainx »

Posting a link like this is fine, no worries.

This has been discussed already somewhere, maybe the "Hi, I'm Craig" thread.

Hopefully they drop the 512MB idea, and only go to the 1GB method... maybe even an option to bump up to more (I would pay more for 2GB of RAM, even though it isn't needed for anything yet).
matt198992
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by matt198992 »

I would have to agree. I am not too fond of the "minimum specs" to run honeycomb. I definitely want a 1gb option or more preferably.
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by gte105u »

I would be shocked to see only 512mb of RAM as the only option. Any tablet I buy from now on will have at least a gig unless it is some dirt cheap off brand I get for my son to play with. With the features and specs Archos is plugging into the Gen9s, I cannot fathom not having a model with at least 1 gig. Honestly I am not sure why they would even make a 512mb model. It cannot be that much cheaper, just bump the price up a tiny bit and make them all 1GB.

My thoughts on this... again not sure why the 512mb is even being offered. That said, it does not really make a difference as long as it is truly an "option". If they make each model available in either 512mb or 1gb then that is fine. But if they only make the 8gb flash model in 512mb RAM and the 250gb HD model in 1gb... then that is not really an option. If you wanted flash storage and 1gb RAM you would have to compromise somewhere. The other issue being that if these things sell out quickly early, there may be a lot of instances where you can get the 512mb model but the 1gb model is unavailable. I have to assume that 1gb RAM, for the difference in cost it would likely be, would be much more popular than the 512mb. This could find a lot of people buying to get it right now instead of getting what they want and being disappointed.

Archos dividing their manufacturing resources when supply has shown to be an issue before seems silly. Again, why not just make the 1gb model, charge a reasonable but slightly higher cost, and focus the manufacturing resources on the devices that will be more attractive?

Does anyone actually prefer the 512mb? How much less (or more) would the one model have to be from the other if all other things were equal for you to go with 512mb vs. 1gb? I hope Archos is paying attention to this kind of stuff because this is free market analysis research if they care to use it...
A70 250GB|Acer A500|HTC Thunderbolt
kronosqq
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by kronosqq »

Hey, first post here but I'm a long time reader for news and a blogger. I found a hands on video from Android Central with a first look at the G9's. The Archos rep there stated that there would be both 512mb and 1gb models available. I'd guess the 101 will be 1GB and the 80 will be 512mb.
I'd bet against the 1 GB in the hard drive models since however slight, using HDD's instead of flash does use more power. So If I were designing these I wouldn't make the HDD/higher RAM the only option for that.
Here's the Android Central link:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HnSSOhIinu0
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by The_Blood_Raven »

Honestly, I wonder what the real world difference is. I know going from my Archos 70 with 256mb to my Asus Transformer with 1GB of RAM is just such a ridiculous difference. However, I also see a lot of tablets coming out with 512mb on Honeycomb from major players, like the Acer Iconia A100. Perhaps the actual difference isn't that great?
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by spawn »

Beleive me, it do make a world of difference

If the Archos gen 9 do not come with 1gb ram - I will not buy it, period.
Every other real competitor's tablet will have 1gb with very few exceptions

512mb is fine for a phone running froyo, but for a tablet running HC its a different ballgame where multitasking is much more normal.
Having 1gb ram instead of 512mb will mean the Android system are able to preload alot more applications to memory and still have more memory free. This ensures alot smoother operation when multitasking between different application, different webpages etc. etc.

It makes no difference to how the individual application will run once started, but it makes a hughe difference in how smooth the tablet feels when you switch between different applications, because the system will not need to load apps from the storage memory and it will not need to close running apps in order to have enough ram to open new apps.

The 256mb ram in the Gen 8 series was a design mistake of gigantic proportions - making a big impact on how well the Gen 8 could have performed. I sincerly do not hope Archos are going to make the same mistake again, and I for certain will not make the same mistake of getting another device with not enough ram.
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by The_Blood_Raven »

spawn wrote:Beleive me, it do make a world of difference

If the Archos gen 9 do not come with 1gb ram - I will not buy it, period.
Every other real competitor's tablet will have 1gb with very few exceptions

512mb is fine for a phone running froyo, but for a tablet running HC its a different ballgame where multitasking is much more normal.
Having 1gb ram instead of 512mb will mean the Android system are able to preload alot more applications to memory and still have more memory free. This ensures alot smoother operation when multitasking between different application, different webpages etc. etc.

It makes no difference to how the individual application will run once started, but it makes a hughe difference in how smooth the tablet feels when you switch between different applications, because the system will not need to load apps from the storage memory and it will not need to close running apps in order to have enough ram to open new apps.

The 256mb ram in the Gen 8 series was a design mistake of gigantic proportions - making a big impact on how well the Gen 8 could have performed. I sincerly do not hope Archos are going to make the same mistake again, and I for certain will not make the same mistake of getting another device with not enough ram.
While i don't disagree with lot of your points, you have nothing to back up these claims. 512mb of RAM may be plenty for a reasonable amount of muti tasking. Just because i can have 10 applications running at once on my transformer, doesn't mean i need to. Plus we may be talking about $300 tablets. If the multi tasking is at least pretty decent, it may not be so terrible.
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by Harfainx »

While 512MB really is *enough* for just about anything, it is always nice to have that extra free RAM to keep other things active on the device. My old EVO (and my wife's current one) have 512MB of RAM and that could still run everything I could throw at it with minimal load times.

My concern about RAM is more based on games, as Android gaming gets more and more expansive, people will need more RAM. Since people will likely be using these Gen9 devices for at least a year, I just want to make sure I have a device that can handle everything for the next year.
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by kronosqq »

For me, a tablet user not really interested in gaming on them, the 1 GB of RAM is to help ensure an experience that will hopefully be as smooth as current honeycomb tablets. If it's not, I might find myself getting one of the Kal-El (Tegra-3) tablets that also come out in Q4 instead of the 101 G9.
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by spawn »

The_Blood_Raven wrote:
While i don't disagree with lot of your points, you have nothing to back up these claims. 512mb of RAM may be plenty for a reasonable amount of muti tasking. Just because i can have 10 applications running at once on my transformer, doesn't mean i need to. Plus we may be talking about $300 tablets. If the multi tasking is at least pretty decent, it may not be so terrible.
nothing except real life experience
through my work I have hands on access to most android devices, phones and tablets alike, and I will still claim that 512mb is not enough to run a smooth honeycomb from what I have tried so far. HC itself use more ram when running than Froyo does, and its not so much about needing to run 10 applications or not, its about the way the android memory management works. This works by automatically having as much applications preloaded in a running or wait state in ram, ready to be used when the user desides to. The less room for apps in this state in ram, the more often you will feel a slight lag when it has to open and start the application from permanent storage and/or when it has to close other apps allready in this state to make room for the new app you want to run. This is definately noticeable in actual use even if it may not be terrible. Beleive me, there is a big difference in having 512mb ram where the system first takes almost 200, and the preloaded apps take another 200 and then having 100mb free to having 1gb where the system takes 200, preloaded apps, widgets, cache ets then having room for 4-600mb and free ram being 200-300mb

And like Harfainx says, sure 512mb is "enough" for most, its not like it wont be useable or apps wont be able to run (atleast most) - but as he also points out about games, newer apps designed for tablet use aswell as newer games being released will inevitably make more and more demands on ram, there are allready games out that require a minimum of 512mb free, and yes sure the EVO and my 512mb devices still run what we throw at them, but we shouldent judge needs based on previous demands or mobile phones running different OS version and smaller apps, we should judge based on future demands, the tablets wont be out untill september and atleast we would expect them to run for 1 year, so your demands on specs should be based on what the needs would/could be in the next 18 months, not the past 18 months

And my experience with other similar devices tells me that my needs for a comfortable use of the tablet over the next 18 months will require not less than 1gb - so for me personally this is a buying demand much more than if the cpu are clocked at 1.2 or 1.5ghz :)

PS: and regarding the price of the device, I prefer paying say $350 for the right product than paying $300 for the wrong product - so when more ram naturally also means a higher price, I prefer paying that price :)
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by frahse »

First off I am not an early adopter.

Because of my engineering and software background, I frown on buying the first model of anything. I know that the 2nd or 3rd model is going to be a good bit better.

Then when I do buy, I make sure to buy the higher end with lots of room for expansion.

For example, I myself use two old computers at home. I bought one a big desktop tower 12 years ago with 128MB of RAm and a 13GB HD. It is now maxed out at about 800MB of Ram, and has a 2nd HD of an additional 320GB, plus I have had a dozen or more external hard drives with the latest at 1.5TB. I have upgraded it to USB2 and it also also gave it a Firewire upgrade years ago, and it has plenty of slots which have been filled over the years. My old giant Sony Trinitron CRT monitor which was one half the original total system cost is still a stand out with the only problem being that it requires extra support (carpentry) for it to sit on my computer desk since it is so heavy. (I don't say how big the Sony is because I am embarrassed at what it cost. - ok, a hint. Over $1000, but I have never ever regretted getting it, only having to explain it.)

The second computer is a large laptop bought 10 years ago came with 256 Ram and now is upgraded to 1GB. It came with Firewire, and I lament the fact that it is impractical to upgrade the USB1 to USB2. I might be able to do it if I had to, but it is not worth the effort. Still I admit thinking about it.

Are there better computers a lot cheaper than what I paid 10 to 12 years ago? Yes. I just bought my wife a nice Toshiba notebook with 4GB RAM, 640GB Storage, a 2nd generation Intel engine, etc., etc. It cost less than a third of what the cheapest of the 10 and 12 years systems did. I made sure the Toshiba could be upgraded to 8GB of RAM, because the day will come when that is needed, I am sure.

I just got my wife a 32GB 4th generation Ipod-touch in part replacing actually a 12 year old mp3 player that I had gotten in those first mp3 player days, and I just got the latest Kindle, 3G myself. I would have gotten the 64GB Ipod-touch except for Apple's ridiculous pricing scheme.

I am looking forward to getting a tablet, but I am willing to wait until it does what I want. I could get one now as far as most capabilities are concerned, but size (See my STAMPEDE article) is the problem. If they had a 5.5 to 6 inch (also thin bezel), that would fit in my shirt pocket, already at the cost of a Samsung or Apple 10 inch, I would already own it. My waiting and searching for such a thing has now convinced me that I really want an Android, but still if Apple came out with something about that size, I might just suck it up and buy it.

My point is that one should think about how your device will mature. Will you be wanting to replace it in a year or two? Even 3 or 4. I think it will be best to pay a little more now and buy something that will last (be sufficient) for longer.

Get as much RAM as you can, or at least the possibility of increasing it later. Also storage.

Now I do get the other side. The desire to get the latest, and the boredom that comes with owning a thing for over a year. I wish I could afford to be that way. (Welcome to being married.)
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by d00b »

>I could get one now as far as most capabilities are concerned, but size (See my STAMPEDE article) is the problem.

I would look at this from a cost-benefit POV. The tablet market for now is coalescing around two sizes, 10" and 7". Were I in your shoes, I would make the effort to adapt my attire (or portage items) to accommodate the 7", because to insist on a 5-6" size means to wait at least a year or two more. The inconvenience of adapting my attire would be outweighed by the opportunity cost of having to wait longer for the desired item.

>My waiting and searching for such a thing has now convinced me that I really want an Android, but still if Apple came out with something about that size, I might just suck it up and buy it.

I had great hopes for Android, being an open-source OS. But its fragmentation and slow pace of progress (on tablets) have moved my hopes onto Win8. Android reminds me too much of the CP/M days where every vendor's devices were incompatible with the next (I wasn't around then, but am old enough to be familiar with the history). DOS killed CP/M then, and the uniformity of Win8 will kill Android.

>My point is that one should think about how your device will mature. Will you be wanting to replace it in a year or two? Even 3 or 4. I think it will be best to pay a little more now and buy something that will last (be sufficient) for longer.

I don't think it's possible to buy a tablet this year and expect it to last for more than a year (if you want to have the latest capability). Progress in both hardware and software is moving too fast. These aren't the staid days of x86 PCs where the OS is upgraded every 3-4 years with marginal improvements, or where PCs get a bit faster every year, but not much else. Android right now is still a nascent OS with many holes in basic functionality. WebOS/QNX/MeeGo are even worse off.

For example, the Tegra 2 came out this year. The Xoom aside, other Teg2 models were just available for retail starting around this time. In another 2-3 months, it will already be obsolete and be replaced by better SoC's. If Archos, a 3rd-tier vendor, can have a better SoC, then most other vendors can have the same.
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by frahse »

d00b

as usual you are quite cogent. Your arguments do strike a responsive chord in me. I am just trying to be responsible with my private purchases.

I don't always wait for the 2nd or 3rd iteration. Sometimes I jump the gun so to speak. For example for my work, I don't wait. I do have the latest and greatest, though some of that is for the psychological effect on the customers. They want to talk about installing the latest (though proven) hardware, and they want their consultants and contractors to carry it as well and that might be a part of how they judge a new face. But I haven't been tempted to carry a non keyboard tablet yet. A friend carries a small laptop that is also a touchscreen like Doctors have used for years. It hasn't impressed me.

BUT I have used touch screen industrial operator controls extensively for at least 15 years, and we first installed one about 20 years ago.

I will use another example. Say you are in a tree blind and can't move about easily, and a deer appears at a distance in fairly heavy brush, at a bad angle. When should you pull the trigger? You pull right away and don't get the positive shot, and you might miss, or make a poor shot, and the deer might make a long run before it stops and you will have to track it down. If you wait a while, you may get a surer shot and be happier with the result. That comes to mind because a friend of mine that flies for SW is trying to get pronghorn permits for Texas in Oct. and I might have the opportunity to go.
Last edited by frahse on Mon Jul 18, 2011 7:02 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by d00b »

@frahse

Actually, I'm in entire agreement with your conservative position. The tablet of today is still mainly a "want" rather than a "need" item. If one needs to go through cost-justification, then the arguments are mostly against buying a tab: a nascent OS and software ecosystem, dodgy user experience, premium-priced hardware, and fast-paced obsolescence.

There are different strategies when buying computing equipment. One is as you mentioned, buying more capabilities than you need in order to lengthen its useful life. I think for this environment, another more apt approach is to buy as cheap as possible (while avoiding the dross) to minimize depreciation loss as the equipment gets quickly obsoleted.

For this latter, more rigorous cost-benefit justification is needed: What do I want/need, what is the most cost-effective way to fulfill those needs, and for how long? True, that hardly anybody would want to think this much for an impulse buy that tablets fall into. But we aren't "anybody," are we?
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by Charbax »

spawn wrote:through my work I have hands on access to most android devices, phones and tablets alike, and I will still claim that 512mb is not enough to run a smooth honeycomb from what I have tried so far.
You haven't tried Honeycomb 3.2, maybe that one requires less RAM for a better multi-tasking experience. It is after all Google's main job, to improve the speed and performance of the Android software. 512MB DDR3 RAM might be much better than 1GB DDR2 RAM. The Texas Instruments OMAP4460 seems to have MUCH better memory bandwidth than Tegra2. Anyways, I do not know how much RAM Archos plans to include and if there might be different RAM options in the different skews that there seems to be.
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by Charbax »

d00b wrote:I had great hopes for Android, being an open-source OS. But its fragmentation and slow pace of progress (on tablets) have moved my hopes onto Win8.
This is ridiculous. Android tablets are about to sell more than iPad before this Christmas, that is a faster growth rate than a year ago when Android Smartphones completely destroyed the iPhone.
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by frahse »

Giving credit to the comments of both Charbax, and d00b, my own opinion is that

I think the Android system is the coming thing for the consumer tablet market.

The Apple system has a head start and has great hardware though sometimes they
don't offer what people other than their (almost blind) followers and adherents have been persuaded to want. I find a lot of fault with the software on my wife's Ipod Touch machine, and end up saying a lot of times "I would have done that different and hopefully better." but I can only admit that is what I say about Windows.

Chippy over at umpc and carrypad wants to wait until win8 because why adopt win7, when win8 is coming. It is called "pie in the sky." Others say webos? is better and lends it self to adaption to other systems and old ones better. But chippy's dream is a "ultra mobile pc -umpc" a small machine that will act like a desktop. I don't see a tablet as a desktop except for the ones that can attach to a keyboard, and mouse and are large. villiv makes some good small ones, but I would never trade them for my laptop and they are too expensive for such small machines.

I believe that Android has enough steam and will pass Apple though Apple has the advantage of a lot of people having spent good money (and a lot of it) on Apple Apps and will want to continue using them.

Win7, win8, Webos? have the advantage of being able to use a lot of legacy stuff, but the greater buying public wants Apps and more Apps for their tablets and doesn't worry about the legacy stuff so much, and we can see that the proprietary apps offered by companies just don't match (number wise) Apple and Android, so I think the mass of people will continue with Apple and Android with Android pulling into the lead eventually.

Of course Android winning is also somewhat of a victory for Microsoft because of their patent holdings. MS are giving HTC hell right now on that single issue.

I want a tablet that will replace the old PDAs I once used. HP and Dell. I have to admit that I went back to the old style 8" notebook type organizer for most things except for data after trying the PDAs for 8 to 10 years. Of course all that time I had a "screamer" work laptop to carry around, but I don't risk that for personal use because of the data and programs that are on it. A friend had his laptop stolen from a rental SUV by someone breaking the vehicle window. There was hell to pay on that one. The loss of time for the job, for replacing the machine, for getting if outfitted out properly for regaining lost information, etc. Of course he was 2000 miles away when it happened and he had to come back to the office just to start get going again. After that we always carried our machines in a sturdy backpack that could be held like a attache case going into a customers office and kept them on our person. At least I do.

I don't foresee the Tablet as a primary work tool yet, except perhaps as a note taker, and secure data holder where I can transfer back and forth to the laptop. I do have a company cellular card for the laptop, so it can backup to the office. Again the laptop is only for business, so I am considering a cellular drive or a tether for the tablet.

At the office I have a 23" monitor because I use a lot of Autocad. I am trying to get at least a 26" one. I mentioned the old big Sony Trinitron at home which I also used for Autocad.
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by matt198992 »

frahse wrote:Giving credit to the comments of both Charbax, and d00b, my own opinion is that

I think the Android system is the coming thing for the consumer tablet market.

The Apple system has a head start and has great hardware though sometimes they
don't offer what people other than their (almost blind) followers and adherents have been persuaded to want. I find a lot of fault with the software on my wife's Ipod Touch machine, and end up saying a lot of times "I would have done that different and hopefully better." but I can only admit that is what I say about Windows.

Chippy over at umpc and carrypad wants to wait until win8 because why adopt win7, when win8 is coming. It is called "pie in the sky." Others say webos? is better and lends it self to adaption to other systems and old ones better. But chippy's dream is a "ultra mobile pc -umpc" a small machine that will act like a desktop. I don't see a tablet as a desktop except for the ones that can attach to a keyboard, and mouse and are large. villiv makes some good small ones, but I would never trade them for my laptop and they are too expensive for such small machines.

I believe that Android has enough steam and will pass Apple though Apple has the advantage of a lot of people having spent good money (and a lot of it) on Apple Apps and will want to continue using them.

Win7, win8, Webos? have the advantage of being able to use a lot of legacy stuff, but the greater buying public wants Apps and more Apps for their tablets and doesn't worry about the legacy stuff so much, and we can see that the proprietary apps offered by companies just don't match (number wise) Apple and Android, so I think the mass of people will continue with Apple and Android with Android pulling into the lead eventually.

Of course Android winning is also somewhat of a victory for Microsoft because of their patent holdings. MS are giving HTC hell right now on that single issue.

I want a tablet that will replace the old PDAs I once used. HP and Dell. I have to admit that I went back to the old style 8" notebook type organizer for most things except for data after trying the PDAs for 8 to 10 years. Of course all that time I had a "screamer" work laptop to carry around, but I don't risk that for personal use because of the data and programs that are on it. A friend had his laptop stolen from a rental SUV by someone breaking the vehicle window. There was hell to pay on that one. The loss of time for the job, for replacing the machine, for getting if outfitted out properly for regaining lost information, etc. Of course he was 2000 miles away when it happened and he had to come back to the office just to start get going again. After that we always carried our machines in a sturdy backpack that could be held like a attache case going into a customers office and kept them on our person. At least I do.

I don't foresee the Tablet as a primary work tool yet, except perhaps as a note taker, and secure data holder where I can transfer back and forth to the laptop. I do have a company cellular card for the laptop, so it can backup to the office. Again the laptop is only for business, so I am considering a cellular drive or a tether for the tablet.

At the office I have a 23" monitor because I use a lot of Autocad. I am trying to get at least a 26" one. I mentioned the old big Sony Trinitron at home which I also used for Autocad.

No, I have to agree tablets are more of a luxury item at this time.

However, looking back at just how FAST tablets came into the market, and all ready they have dual cores, processors BETTER than my old tablet, I really am astounded. How long has it been since the iPad? 5 or 6 years if that? It didn't REALLY become a big deal until all of the other tech companies started making tablets too. Then competition rose, and so did demand. I just cannot believe how fast they are progressing. I give it another 5, 10 tops, until they are as fast as my current desktop.

It also astounds me as to how Apple can be so blindingly ignorant of the demand of the consumers for the sheer sake of gaining profits. Lately it seems that anyone that makes anything remarkably similar to something they make, or even when someone produces something amazing for tablets, Apple buys them out, or sues for rights. But what really gets me is how close-minded they are to aspiring developers. It is surprisingly hard to make something for the iPad, and just as hard to get it approved and posted on the app store.

That said, I think this is why android will be dominating the market soon. If you pay attention to the news, it really seems anyone who is a threat to Apple's iPad is called a "thief" and taken to court. Android sales are steadily catching up to iPad, and instead of producing a truly "unique" next gen iPad (that people seem to blindly believe Apple does on a constant basis), they are trying to monopolize the market as much as possible by booting competitors away from the tablet industry... and it isn't working.

Android OS is also wide open and seems much more versatile than any other OS tablet. If I am not mistaken, it is simply javascript coding (amongst a splash of python and xml), and posting stuff to the market and selling your product has nearly no restrictions. I think this is what is pushing the android to have the most sales. Not to mention that the tablet market is still fresh, and developers are still getting their feet wet; Soon we will see some truly remarkable games and applications. I just don't see Apple beating that...at all.

I haven't looked into the windows tablets too much; They seem infantile compared to the android tablets and the iPad (in my eyes at least). While i like the idea of having a full blown windows OS on my tablet, I just don't think they are fast enough right now to make proper use of that.

I think android tablets will become bigger over the next few years (in the sense that we will see them more commonly used for a wider range of tasks), and I really can't wait. :lol:
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Re: Archos RAM

Post by MarcusMarcus »

What ever the RAM amount. I hope they improve the internal flash. The flash in the current gen 8s is too slow. When the tablet has to load an app (or reload an app because it did not have enough RAM to keep it running) it takes a while to load, especially when it has to keep reloading the launcher. If they would get a decently fast flash inside the tablets, the low amount of RAM would not be as noticeable. Still would prefer 1GB of RAM though.
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